Ultimate Universe - Part 1
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Yeti Stereo Microphone: [00:00:00] Welcome to the multi-verse in this podcast, we're diving into the ultimate universe specifically. Ultimate Spider-Man a little bit of ultimate invasion. This is part one of a two part series on the ultimate universe.
Yeti Stereo Microphone-1: We'll drop you right into the conversation, talking about Hickman and his transition from being the head of all things ex to the head of all beings. Ultimate./ Here you go.
Jason: Is now the king of the ultimate verse head of ultimate. He's no longer the X king head of X. Yeah. He's now the ultimate.
Scott: He's trying to be Brian Bendis. Is he? Well, I mean, Bendis and Muller started the ultimate Spider Man back in the day. And I wish Bendis would be Bendis.
I wish he would too, but does anyone see my old friend? Wow. You know, when the Ultimate Invasion and Ultimate Relaunch came about, I was a little skeptical for multiple different [00:01:00] reasons and I will have to say that I did not read and digest and study that miniseries as much as I have fallen in love with the Ultimate Spider Man.
The Ultimate Spider Man.
Jason: OG Ultimate Spider Man
Scott: or the new one? The OG Spider Man. I was OG Ultimate Spider Man. I was a fan of that day one, but the Hickman Spider Man. I've said this about other books before and I'll say it about this one. This is a Spider Man book that I didn't know I needed. Right.
Stephen: Yep.
Scott: That's the way of putting it. If you know, we'll start with issue, I've read issue one and two, but I know everyone here has read issue one. When you dust away the muck of the fallout of the Ultimate Spider Man. Fight and people dying and all of this. As an adult fan, what I wanted was a married Peter Parker.
With kids. I really didn't know I needed Uncle Ben alive. Right. But I'm quite enjoying Uncle Ben's presence with him and J. Jonah Jameson as partners. Which is. [00:02:00] A lot of fun. It is. And I was a fan of Peter Parker being married to Mary Jane anyhow. I was a fan of that relationship. That should always be the case.
And, you know, Superman and Lois have proven that it's all right for your character to be married and you can still relate. You 50 or anything either. But this is a visibly Parker is in his late 30s probably at this point. Got a couple of kids, and I, because it's Hickman, and I've gone on record saying that I have a lot of trepidation sometimes with his work.
I thoroughly enjoyed this book from start to finish, and I've read it twice. Before the first printing became so valuable that I didn't want to damage it because I am that kind of geek. Not that I would ever sell any of my books as we've talked about in a podcast before, but I don't want to close that op, that door.
Jason: Yeah, because I haven't seen, I haven't seen Spider Man being Spider Man yet.
Scott: This one gives you Spider Man being Spider Man. [00:03:00] And, Hickman does a very good job of, Peter Parker still has his quips, but it's coming from a standpoint of, this Peter Parker's in a world that's never had heroes or villains.
So why would there be villains? So it goes back to, Something I remember in Avengers movie, Civil War, where the Vision was talking about how the villains had made a pretty exponentially grown just by Tony Stark's appearance. Well, you have a very new version of the Shocker. Okay. And their interaction I laughed my ass off.
You know, you already have Wilson Fisk and there's, you know, all this shadow cabinet of, you know, the Makers, Minions that are left behind. But apparently the world doesn't really know super villains exist. If Hickman can keep this energy up. This will be my [00:04:00] spider man book for the next 200 issues that they could keep it going, right?
Bendis kept that energy up and I had I followed that but that was the well, let's take it back to younger this is not that and What's been fun is talking to people in the store every age group has latched on to this
And I know I'll chime in as y'all recount your experience with issue one.
Okay,
Stephen: I'm right there with you. I thoroughly enjoyed it. I am coming to this as someone who actually was never a fan of the Ultimate Universe. I did follow Bendis run. But I followed it in the Marvel Deluxe hardcovers, where where you're collecting like 12 issues or something, you know, I think I had like the first three of those.
And what I found is, I enjoyed it. Okay it's Bendis writing, it's fun Bagley's art is works, you know, it's, it, again, it's okay. I enjoyed it. But there was nothing new. I [00:05:00] didn't feel this, that all of it kind of just felt to me like you're taking something that I'm already intimately familiar with.
Maybe you're giving it some spins. Okay. But there's, there just wasn't anything there that made me feel like I would be missing out on something until miles. And if it right, we'll come to that in a second. The ultimate, I. I actually kind of, there's a part of me that sort of found the Ultimates to be a little bit offensive.
Because it just seemed like, I don't know, it was the existing characters that we know, but kind of pushed to these extremes. Captain America is this, you
Scott: know. He was a Marine. Yeah. I remember them describing and, I followed, you know, What I enjoyed about Bendis run on Ultimate Spider Man is that it allowed my kids and I to talk about Spider Man.
Right, okay, I get that. That was interesting, but I remember a description, I don't know if it was Mark Waid or Mark Millar that said, his Captain [00:06:00] America was a marine. Type gung ho and that the Marvel 616 was an army guy Mentality and all in that Tony's the Tony Stark character was the worst version, right?
Can they all
Stephen: kind of seem to be like the worst versions? I mean Captain America the a doesn't stand for France Okay, that was funny.
Scott: And I think at the time I don't remember if Busick and Perez were doing the Avengers or if we were still dealing with the Heroes Reborn, kind of the gap in there, but I think it filled a gap of, you know, Bill Jemis was part of Marvel, they were coming back up, but they were stumbling, still, because that was 2000, so.
The only thing about the Ultimates was at the time, post 9 11, that It vibrated something with people that the regular Avengers was not, but I read it. I appreciated what it was, but it was, if you stuck a music Perez Avengers in front of me, or. These two guys, I like [00:07:00] hitches art, but I prefer the old, I prefer the classic.
Stephen: But there's, like I said, it's, it sort of feels like, you know, like when you go to the convenience store, you can either get Gatorade or you can get extreme Gatorade. crazy flavors. And that's kind of what it felt like exactly what it was. And I know that ties in with the kind of Bill Jemas let's go out there,
Scott: you know, because we had Quicksilver and his sister, very uncomfortable.
Stephen: You've got the thing with the Hulk and the cannibalism and it's just, and it's all very like what this is all. And, you know, Thor. That, I may be misremembering this, but Thor seemed like, you know, this is actually a guy
Scott: who he, yeah. We don't know if he's a thunder god or not.
Jason: We don't, yeah.
Like there was a sciencey thing in there and
Stephen: he's
Scott: like, yeah, anyway, and then they resolved it later. But that's, we'll go back to what we were it's just too much.
Jason: So I liked, what I liked about the Ultimates was I liked the Captain America. They showed me, like the ultimate starts off with a scene they, they used in, whatever the good Captain America movie was.
Scott: That's the first [00:08:00] one.
Jason: Winter Soldier, right? Yeah. It's the, I think it's the best of the, oh, it is.
Scott: Well, winter Soldier is the best but I'm trying to figure out what scene you're talking about. Was in Winter
Jason: Soldier. So, the first time you see Captain Ultimates, it's actually the same scene that when, from the first time you see him in Winter Soldier where.
He's flying over something. Oh, he just jumps out of the plane without the parachute and they're like, did he just jump out without a chute? Yeah, he does that like That was so badass when I read that the first I was like, that's the coolest thing I've ever seen and They did that in the movie later and I did I was like, that's perfect That's exactly right.
Stephen: So, yeah, that X-Men was just kind of rambling, teenage angst.
Jason: I missed the X-Men one. I didn't read that at
Stephen: all. Just didn't I, like I said, I just didn't connect to it. Miles
Jason: morale, I ran fast. Ran, I read
Scott: I Fast Times original. How much has Jason drank tonight? Kids . Well, it's good.
Jason: This is gonna be a long podcast so that I can drive home afterwards.
Yeah
Scott: But you were a fan of the ultimate fantastic four is what you were [00:09:00] trying
Jason: to pick it up later Yeah, and I are it's the first it's the only time I ever connected with a fantastic four story. Okay
Stephen: Yeah Now miles Morales that was to me that was kind of the key game changer Because that was something different same but different But like I said, I just didn't, the actually the only Ultimate book that I really followed, and of course it's the one that got cancelled, was Ultimate Marvel Team Up.
Because I really liked the art choices on that, but anyway. So, they got rid of the Ultimate Universe, Secret Wars, blew it up, blah blah blah blah blah so hearing that they're doing Another go at ultimate books. I was like, Oh, really? Okay. But what I've, what I liked and thought was very smart for somebody like me was ultimate invasion because it's an ultimate book in the 616.[00:10:00]
So they're like, well, okay, we're doing something here. We're actually going somewhere with this. I like the idea and I'm really hoping I'm right on this. is that for this iteration of Ultimate Books, it's going to be almost like DC Elseworlds. The character is there, but the scenario, the situation, everything is going to be quite different.
That that's interesting to me, that's exciting to me. That was the thing about the original Ultimate comic line that I thought was missing. It's like, well, It's the same thing that we've already had, except you're adding either more modern sensibility to it or, in the case of The Ultimates, to me, a more cynical sensibility to it.
But it, but it again, it's still the same thing. This one, yeah, we've got Parker married, but it's more than that. He's older, he missed out on things, it's a different world. Yep. [00:11:00] All the previews I've seen, Peach Momoko's Ultimate X Men, I can't wait to read that. Because that is going to be as far away from the X Men that, I mean, I don't even know why it's called an X Men book.
I'm really curious to find out why it's called an X Men book. Okay I haven't read Black Panther. But I'm curious, I'm interested. This is different. So I like that. The fact that it's the park marriage, look. We old dinosaurs here. We all have our very strong opinions about the decision to, to undo that marriage.
I think it's a good idea. I've yet to actually look editorial though. They still talk about this in the letters, pages of Spider Man, the editors are still trying to justify this and dah, whatever. I don't care. When they did renew your vows I'm still hearing about renew your vows. Yes that little mini series that
Scott: secret war.
Yeah, because it was
Stephen: like, oh, [00:12:00] thank goodness. There's still a place for this people want to see that and Okay, you're not gonna do it in the six one six fine Are we going to get this ultimate? Yeah, I think you're right, Scott. I do. I think this is going to be the spider book to follow. I do wonder what, I'd love to know what editorial thinks of that when, if that were the case.
I guess we'll find out.
Jason: I was just going to say, I like this Spider Man for the same reasons I like Superman and Lois. Superman and Lois, it feels like, well. I think they kind of figured out who their audience is at this point, right? Their audience is an aging audience. It's it's people like us that have been reading these things for a while.
And Superman and Lois very much was like a, Oh, that's a problem I get. Like Superman finally has a, you know, Teenage son. Yeah. And like the whole, you know, Do I, you know, fulfill my responsibilities at work or spend more time with my [00:13:00] family? That balance is something we always have a problem with.
And I think that's where Spider Man is going to be. I think that, or I'm hoping that's where he ends up. I'm hoping he ends up in a place where, Oh gosh, I need to be this hero, but I got these kids and I got to do something for them. And then
Scott: I will tell you, we'll like issue number two. All right. Quite a bit.
Because it You know, editorial, yeah, they were all on board with it at first because at the time, anytime you rebooted anything, it got better. Okay. They kind of, you know, they think, Hey, we're going to need five number one issues. That that, that thing, I think, and you all know at the time they were, they wanted to freshen up Spider Man.
If you'd had a better tool for removing Mary Jane other than the devil did it. If you know, at the time the writer doing it didn't want to do it anyhow. Writer Ron Quezada thought it was a great idea. [00:14:00] Whether he really did or not is uh, because whether I like the breakup of the marriage or not.
I don't know. Are the stories that follow memorable and relevant? Right. You were hopping writers. He had a rotating staff. No, it was
Stephen: brand new day. Brand
Scott: new day, and then you were hopping between Wade and some other people. Not bad talent. No. B minus B. Again, Dan
Stephen: Slott, I think he, yeah, he did great.
Scott: And I own all those issues.
Excellent. Other than the Obama cover, I can't tell you a damn thing about that block of stories. Other than everyone at the time was waiting for the hook of what was going to undo this. Right. So they got back together. Right. And they teased it. Yeah. Here and there. And they never did it. Right. But then they would date.
Shoot on a [00:15:00] nightclub, then they break up, go away, and then Jackpot. Yep.
Jason: What's the story in the current
Scott: storyline? She's with another dude from a different dimension. Kids kind of did a Wanda and Vision thing and disappeared. She was. She was. I don't know if she's still with the guy now. She's It's another one of those, if you're not going to put them back together.
Kill her. Get her out of the book. You already tried to make her Tony Stark's girlfriend for a while. Oh, I didn't see that. Yeah, that was in Bendis Iron Man for a while. She was when, she was over there. You know, her and Wolverine, you know, all of this. If you're not going to do the character justice, I'd rather see you put a bullet through her head in something meaningful and it, did
Stephen: you read Nick Spencer's run on Amazing
Scott: Spider Man? Which one was that? It
Stephen: was the previous one
Scott: to Zip Girl's. Yes.
Stephen: What [00:16:00] did you think of, because to me, it was kind of building to something and building to something. That's right. It went up and down with the Osborn going good and then the, You know, blah, blah, blah.
That's the
Jason: Golden Goblin thing and all that stuff.
Stephen: Yeah. But in the end, the final moment, you kind of realize that one of the things that Spence has been building up to and building up to is that he is going to try and make sense of the
Scott: Mephisto thing. Yeah, because there was a time where Dr. Strange knew something was wrong for half a second.
Yeah.
Stephen: I see. I quite, I know Nick Spencer's got, you know, people kind of were very critical of of him for a number of reasons. Isn't he still writing it? No, Zeb Wells now. That's right.
Scott: Zeb Wells. That's when I gave up. I gave up on this Spider Man right before Gang War.
Stephen: Right. Okay.
I'm enjoying it. I like the voice. [00:17:00] The voice is pretty good. It does feel like a good Spider Man comic so I just try and take it for what it is and not think too much about what it's not. Yes. But Nick Spencer at the end, trying to make some kind of a sense. Because they
Scott: moved in together, didn't they?
Weren't they? They were starting to or something? Yeah, kind of. And then we start this new series where they were apart. Yeah.
Stephen: Yeah. Yeah. It does feel like they are kind of moving together. It's just we're going to do this in a very slow, methodical way. But I actually really liked, I know a lot of people didn't, but I really liked Nick Spencer's reveal that the reason why Mephisto is constantly messing with Peter Parker is because he's seeing the future and he knows that it's Parker's offspring.
That's what I mean. That will be his undoing. So that's why it's so important for him to undo that relationship. And [00:18:00] it's like, you know something if the if one more day had just the thought to maybe offer an explanation as to why Mephisto would want to
Scott: do this. Other than bring an MA back
Stephen: in the day.
Yeah. It would have been because it's like, that was one of the big critiques and it's still a critique. I would say. Why does Mephisto care? I want to steal your marriage. I want to steal your love. Bloody Mephisto, what do you care?
Scott: Yeah, well they,
Jason: That, Because he's Mephisto, he's a bad guy. He's
Scott: got one of Marvel's devils, yeah.
He's got bigger things that he could be doing. Can't he go mess with the silver surfer, isn't that what he usually does? Yeah, exactly.
Stephen: But, so I liked that. I was like, oh, finally, someone's picked up on the idea that actually, it would help if maybe we had a little bit of reasoning.
Scott: But, and I guess I missed that part when I said wishing death on Mary Jane, if there's some kind of undertow where, Oh, if they get together, they're going to strike fine.
That's still,
Stephen: it's not the best, but it's the, someone's trying, someone's
Scott: trying. Yes. And that's someone tried [00:19:00]
Jason: all this to say the ultimate version.
Scott: And their version of Kingpin as a publisher. Was very interesting to very interesting. Yeah, I was like that makes a lot of sense so Now I did read Black Panther How is that?
Not bad. It's a little more mystical because You have the Wakanda's dealing with the disciples of ksu, whoever, moon Knight, Kue, ksu. Oh. And so, oh, shoot. And so that's a neat take. Okay. And they have these, I don't know if they're really humans or robots, but they're moon nights or some kind of automated Okay.
Time times. They're killing Wakandans. And it looks like storm shows up at the end. Okay. With Black Panther, but it's. At first it starts off like, oh, this is just another T'Challa story. And there's just a little bit of twist here with them acknowledging something's going on with the [00:20:00] maker. Something's just not right.
The world doesn't feel like it should. Pete senses that in issue one, where it's like, I'm missing something. They're a little more scientific, but they don't go very far with it. So I enjoyed that. I think the hype for that is more the fact that Random house took a case of those books and set them in a broom closet and shut the door and went You saw what happened with ultimate spider man one kids.
We're gonna do here. I know right. Don't fall for the hype Just wait for the second printing exactly.
Jason: Well, I think on this one that what's interesting to me Is again moon knight is one of those characters where? I always want moon knight to be cool. Like I want to find a story that I like moon knight In his own book Doesn't happen that often.
The best I've seen him is when he was fighting the Avengers Like in that storyline they just did. Not too long ago, maybe a year ago. Yeah,
Stephen: in Jason Aaron's room.
Jason: Yeah. Yeah, so that was the coolest Moon Knight I've seen in a little while But the [00:21:00] idea of Moon Knight versus Black Panther, it's pretty good.
Yeah.
Scott: Yeah, absolutely. I like that. So, so I'm definitely gonna go with Spider Man Absolutely. Oh, yeah my, my fear is that when Hickman is done with this, now, I don't know if this is supposed to be all ongoing series or if there's like Hickman, there's a definitive beginning. an end. Like, we're going to start this storyline.
Is there a chance this Peter Parker is going to end up in our universe? That kind of, what's going to, because this is the idea of him splitting these universes apart. But if the status quo is, the status quo of we're just cranking these out because we want to do the ultimate verse again, I hope this book goes as long and maintains the quality that Ultimate Spider Man did.
The first time around because that's my spider man book, right? All of that.
But if Hickman, you know, does his 12 and gets bored and walks off and then [00:22:00] they give it to Dan slot. Um, what is that? Yeah. With the fear, with any time you change writers or greater team, the book, that's all.
Scott: But this is more one of these. You know, I feel bad for Duggan having to show up after Hickman on the X Men. I would rather have a colonoscopy without any numbing. Because, I, it's probably more comfortable than going, He took the binder with him? What was that? What was the last 500 pages?
What was his plan?
Jason: Wait, how do you translate that language that shows up there? Where are those characters
Scott: all over the place? That's
Stephen: what he needed the free trading
Scott: card for. Yeah, that's what had it on there. Bastard. Sorry, this is all still after dark, but I know
Stephen: right well, but I know I agree with you because that's the thing with Hickman is that I want to see what the payoff is going to be.
Now I we don't know. We talked about this in a previous podcast. We don't know if the end of the Hickman. The X [00:23:00] Men story that Hickman began. We don't know if the ending that we're getting right now is in line with what he had originally envisioned. I would suspect it's a bit of yes and a bit of no.
Okay. The fact that they're going to wrap it up and then restart or whatever the, obviously we're heading somewhere. And it's like, okay, I think Duggan did an admiral job of picking up after Hickman. But no, I'm with you on this because it's like, look, I want to see. This has so much potential.
Yes. I want to see this. I want to see the, and Hickman can do the long fantastic four Avengers. He can do the long game and I think he does it very well. Stick the landing, please. Yes. Don't bail. Yeah, absolutely. I agree with you. They.
Scott: I didn't pick up on it at the end of issue one. When Parker gets his costume.
Issue two is the payoff where it's the start of the black costume. Okay. That's not a symbiote. And [00:24:00] there's just some fun with I have to read this. Yeah, it's over there on the wall. I mean No, I've got it. It's the As parents who have kids, imagine you going home I as a superhero and your kids don't know it and you've got a nosy six year old daughter.
Hilarity. There's just little subtle moments and I was like, I enjoy that, that, that hits closer to home than it should. And his interaction with the shocker I laughed my, because you see the, you know, inexperience as a teenager is one thing. Inexperience as a 35 year old man, you would think. Some things that were being said to you, you wouldn't fall for.
Right. But in a world that doesn't have superheroes and supervillains, you don't know, you don't know what you're looking at. That's right. So that was a lot of fun. So if you haven't bought that book, kids, go find it or be patient. There'll be a second, a third and a fourth printing. Don't sell your spare tire to go get this.
But unless you're [00:25:00] selling your spare tire
Jason: to get it from us. Yeah, that's right. That's true. Multiverse dot shop.
Scott: Shameless club help himself. It's three times in the evening, but it's once per episode. So it's not, it feels worse to us, but it's new viewers are hearing it for the first time.
Stephen: So, and you know, it, it justifies to a certain degree.
I think you will be able to find that third printing. I think that'll be an easy find. Because, well we, I don't know how many, I don't know how many we've ordered. That's a question worth asking. Because anyway. One million.
Scott: One million. One million
Jason: dollars. I would not, well, I don't know. It's funny.
When this happens, it's really hard to judge. So the second printing for this book, We had to FOC it before the first printing went on sale. So,
Scott: I, I think it's fascinating that everyone in the industry missed it. [00:26:00] Yeah. And that's telling by either, did you not have, I don't know if I was in charge of ordering it.
I don't know if I'd done any better or worse. I don't know if ultimate invasion didn't sell or spark. It didn't. It didn't do great. Maybe people just rolled their eyes. Well, it was a great
Jason: story. I enjoyed the story, but it didn't
Scott: fly off the shelves. I think more like, once again, this Ultimate Spider Man is the book you didn't know you needed.
It's giving you this, you know, Marvel movies, whatever. It's giving you the story people really wanted because they're stabbing each other to try to get a first print. Right. So It's just interesting to see that but, well, the
Jason: speculators are hilarious. Oh, well, they are. It's a lot of fun to watch.
So the speculators, they're like, what's special about this thing? Is it a first appearance of it? They're like, well, no, but it's a really good story. Right. And like, you hear them talk about it, like, but what's so great about [00:27:00] this? The story is really great. So it happened to be that book came out on a day that
I was filling in like the first time John's been sick in four years or something, right? So
Scott: that's our store manager gang. Just
Jason: let you know. Yeah, so it was a Wednesday that I filled in And my daughter was working here, too I was like, oh man, we have a crap ton of these ultimate spider mans and nobody bought the other thing so I'm hand selling the snot out of these things.
I'm like, have you read this? Because I read it before we opened, right? I was like, that's actually a pretty good story So I put them all up front and I'm hand selling the things. I'm like we've got like a million covers here. I think the black symbiote cover is going to
Scott: be the hot one. And I think it was supposed to be part of our number one boxes, but Jason sold through them to like that day.
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it was, we were pumping them out.
Jason: So I remember this one guy, he had no idea the book was coming out. I said, Oh, here's the premise. Cause I just read it. and I didn't know it was [00:28:00] gonna be good, but it's probably good. He bought literally every cover. He bought every cover. So we sold out of this thing I guess we ultimately would have anyway.
And I'm sort of kicking myself for not like ultimately stashing ultimately boom kid. Yeah. But, it was so much fun. It was a super fun day to work in a comic shop. Sure, that's exciting, that's part of the fun. It was a cool story coming out that you hadn't seen before, and you could talk to people about a lot
Scott: of fun.
Yeah, no that's the magic of what we do. Is, you know, the interactions and push, but that's, like I said, like Stephen reiterated, I hope they stick the landing. Yeah. And if it decides, I hope he's on it for a hundred issues, if he can maintain this quality, because this will be the Spider Man book that I want my long in the two Spider Man book to keep up with.
Yes. To do something with it. I'm
Jason: struggling with, I keep, Spidey's another one. I really want to like him. I picked up all the gang war stuff. Oof.
Scott: Well, it's tough getting work and you know, I and I enjoy [00:29:00] Ramita spider man because I liked it back Now dan green's not inking him like he did back then.
I mean, I do question where those ankles go sometimes on those You know, but that's spider man so he can point him. He can point. He's very bendy. At least he has ankles. Mr. Rob Liefeld. And it Like I said, I don't bag on the art as much but it is There's just sometimes And I don't have my finger on it Completely to articulate properly, but there are elements for a good spider man story where there's a little bit of heart a lot of humor a little bit of sass I mean, I don't mind the parker luck thing, but It kills me during the david michelini years wasn't Prominent and it was still fun stories, but it had that Mary jane, I think mary jane for me made it A better book.
Yes So I hope that once again, I hope this one, I can't recommend it enough.
Jason: That'd be a great story. If you're not going to have him with Mary Jane have him hook up with Domino. So now he has all the good luck.
Scott: Do that
Jason: [00:30:00] be so all the good
Scott: luck comes as well. Or could you imagine Pete being there and now Domino has bad luck.
Didn't
Stephen: black cat have bad luck
Scott: powers? Yeah, she did. She does. And I think she still has something. But now her and I mean her and Mary Jane, Or hanging out. That is actually clear. And I enjoyed that. That Mary Jane special where Pete wakes up and sees them both there in black cat outfits like oh not this dream again Just be gentle they're the frumple you the thrumple you want not psychic green and jean gray, but those that's the
Stephen: I don't remember which book it is.
Jason: I think every podcast comes in like this
Stephen: I don't remember which I think it was amazing spider man. It was a variant cover an amazing spider man terry dodson And it the drawing is I think Black Cat is at a window and Mary Jane is like, like helping her to steal something or whatever.
But the alarm has been tripped. And the cover and the blurb The the blurb from black cat is, you know, what does he see in you? Something like that. I
Scott: [00:31:00] was like, Oh, this is so much
Stephen: fun, you know? Cause that's like every person's nightmare, isn't it? The two ex girlfriends who are still in your life become friends.
Jason: Well,
Stephen: you know, Mary Jane that time, you know, she's got this very sort of confident out there personality and Parker has that, but it only comes out when he's wearing the costume.
So that was like, Oh, he's going to have this sort of bombastic vibrant thing in his life. I just, it worked for me. I mean, you know, we're talking about the ultimate, you talk about Spider Man, what ends up happening invariably, we start talking about, why did you have to undo the, you know, blah, blah,
Scott: blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
It just all comes back to Mary Jane. It
Stephen: does. It really does.
But but no, I think just Ultimate Spider Man. Yeah, go buy it, kids. Great setup. Go follow it. If you're a lapsed Spider Man fan, maybe you haven't been too happy with it.
I'd give it a chance [00:32:00] because I think, we don't know, but I think, I'm confident that we're going to get something kind of special out of this. And I actually, I really like the comment that you made about how this is going to give a challenge to Amazing Spider Man. And it's like, yeah, absolutely, because Amazing Spider Man should be the flagship Spider Man book.
If this ends up being the flagship Spider Man book, then Amazing Spider Man really needs to up its game.
Jason: Well, but that's what happened with, when Bendis had Ultimate, too. Yeah. Yeah, it also that was absolutely the flagship Spider Man book of its time. That's right. So why is that? I think it's just the writing talent on it.
I mean, Bendis, it was fun, it was fast, it was It brought all the joy back to Spider Man.
Scott: And Bagley was the Spider Man artist for the longest time on the A book. So when they got him on this experiment. Cause remember, this was a pissing contest [00:33:00] between Jemis and Quezada. You know, cause we had Marvel Knights starting.
All of that. That was a very odd time for Marvel. Um, those Bendis, Bagley issues. Even though there were a lot of rehash. No surprise. Who's the green goblin? Oh, I know. It's that guy over there with the hair. It was, at first I think it was the art, because they're like, oh, Bagley's back on Spider Man.
Right. And Ben just brought a certain humanity to Pete that, you know, people were still, you know, I, like, I don't remember if he'd lost the Mary Jane marriage or not. Stravinsky's Spider Man at the time, you know, with the Ezekiel storyline and all that was good, but almost too smart. I mean, two, I mean, spider totem, you know, you know, we're going to get wrapped up in this cocoon and come break.
I mean, is that my Spider Man? Is that, you know, it, you know, that strange stuff where, you know, nine [00:34:00] different Spider Man titles are all crossing over the other storyline that I don't even remember, but Peter David was a part of that. I love Peter David. I don't know, that's an interesting thought. It almost was a Spider Man title implosion, because you lost Spider Man, Spectacular, everything caved in.
Web, all that caved in right around, you know, one year up, one year back, around that. But, that's a whole other podcast, kids, how about we wrap it up gentlemen? I think so. And we'll do this again. There
Jason: you go. All right, true believers. We will see you next week. Same bat time, same bat channel.
Stephen: Same spider channel, same spider.
Jason: Spider Man.
Spider Man does whatever a
Stephen: spider can. That's copyright infringement.
Scott: Isn't there only three verses? Then he's right.
Stephen: Catches thieves just like flies. And then I'm going to start singing the other 60's Marvel cartoon. Here comes Spider Man.
Jason: Alright, see you folks. Here we go./
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